Progress is good. Managed to source a steel stockholder, a powder coater and an engineering company, all within a 10 mile radius of home. Have bought 18 meters of 38.1 mm (10 guage) seamless tube which will form the main tubes of the chassis.
Cutting list has been prepared for the main section and I'm ready to start cutting, bending and saddling the tube.
Woot! :)
On the other hand, the progress on the motor is slow. The most difficult problem is sourcing parts. Ordinary stuff like gasket sets, ancillary engine parts are just SOOOO difficult to find! I never really took this into account when deciding on the Alfa boxer motor but thinking about it now, the design IS 20 - 30 years old.
Generally though, things are happening at a dizzying rate of knots. I love it whwn a plan comes together! :)
Sunday, 21 December 2008
Tuesday, 18 November 2008
Weekend spannerings...
I stripped the motors at the weekend. I havn't actually done much spannering for a while but I was looking forward to getting my hands dirty.
The first motor I stripped was in pretty bad shape. Having been blown (10 years ago) I was expecting some damage. The further I stripped it the more damage I discovered. The motor is pretty much unuseable. It would require a full rebuild which, in fact, I was and still am, quite prepared to do.
I was a little disappointed as this particular engine was the 105 bhp version with twin Webers and the single lobe cams. I wanted, if possible to rebuild this particular engine as opposed to the other.
The other 'sud motor I had picked up earlier was the 85 bhp version which would have different heads, cams and would have had a single carburettor.
A little bit of research suggested that these were the main and only differences between the two motors.
My only option was to hold my breath, strip the other motor and hope that the condition of the internals was good.
Thankfully, it was good. So good in fact, that it would probably rebuild with very few new parts.
Woot!
The first motor I stripped was in pretty bad shape. Having been blown (10 years ago) I was expecting some damage. The further I stripped it the more damage I discovered. The motor is pretty much unuseable. It would require a full rebuild which, in fact, I was and still am, quite prepared to do.
I was a little disappointed as this particular engine was the 105 bhp version with twin Webers and the single lobe cams. I wanted, if possible to rebuild this particular engine as opposed to the other.
The other 'sud motor I had picked up earlier was the 85 bhp version which would have different heads, cams and would have had a single carburettor.
A little bit of research suggested that these were the main and only differences between the two motors.
My only option was to hold my breath, strip the other motor and hope that the condition of the internals was good.
Thankfully, it was good. So good in fact, that it would probably rebuild with very few new parts.
Woot!
Brief respite...
A couple of months ago I got a response from one of the guys on the forum. Basically, he wanted to generate some space in his garage and offered me a 1.5 liter Alfasud motor free to collect. The motor hadn't run for 6-7 years so its condition could not be determined. I took a gamble on it and travelled south of Sheffield to pick it up.
I was made up! At last I had something to measure! Something to visualize my chassis around!
The motor had no ancillarys, just the bare block with heads.
At the very least, I really needed a gearbox too. Then I could get an idea of how and where the drive shafts would likely be situated, I could determine the track, wheelbase and ground clearance from that. I needed to know how long the unit would be when bolted together so I could determine the pillion position and all that stuff. So, I put out a message on the forum asking if anyone had a suitable gearbox they were willing to sell.
As luck would have it, within a week I had a response. I was offered a 1.5 gearbox plus, another motor with all its ancillary parts! Woot!
The following weekend I was away early to Merseyside to pick up the parts. These were also free to collect.
I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw all this stuff. Carbs, radiator, alternator, starter...everything. The motor had blown due to an oil pump failure but hey! Yet again I was in receipt of parts, parts and more parts. Things were looking good.
I was made up! At last I had something to measure! Something to visualize my chassis around!
The motor had no ancillarys, just the bare block with heads.
At the very least, I really needed a gearbox too. Then I could get an idea of how and where the drive shafts would likely be situated, I could determine the track, wheelbase and ground clearance from that. I needed to know how long the unit would be when bolted together so I could determine the pillion position and all that stuff. So, I put out a message on the forum asking if anyone had a suitable gearbox they were willing to sell.
As luck would have it, within a week I had a response. I was offered a 1.5 gearbox plus, another motor with all its ancillary parts! Woot!
The following weekend I was away early to Merseyside to pick up the parts. These were also free to collect.
I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw all this stuff. Carbs, radiator, alternator, starter...everything. The motor had blown due to an oil pump failure but hey! Yet again I was in receipt of parts, parts and more parts. Things were looking good.
Saturday, 15 November 2008
Back to the drawing board...
Hmmm... not a great place to be either!
It's quite a hard thing to accept that you got it wrong. But I did.
My original project plan gives me until the New Year (2009) to complete the research/design phase. I don't intend to start the build for real until January. I HOPE to build from January until October and by then, have a rolling chassis from which I hope to apply for the SVA test.
So, where am I now? I'm very happy that I dumped the VW design. Right now, the design is such that the Alfasud motor will be in the forward facing (correct) orientation. The motor will also lie forward of the rear axle which is also, I believe, the right design decision for the trike as far a weigh distribution is concerned.
All this does mean that the entire chassis (not just the front end) will have to be designed and built. This has real benefits but also makes the design a little more complex.
I have preliminary drawings which I hope to link to from my blog. I will be inviting advice, comments and discussion on the design once the images are linked.
It's quite a hard thing to accept that you got it wrong. But I did.
My original project plan gives me until the New Year (2009) to complete the research/design phase. I don't intend to start the build for real until January. I HOPE to build from January until October and by then, have a rolling chassis from which I hope to apply for the SVA test.
So, where am I now? I'm very happy that I dumped the VW design. Right now, the design is such that the Alfasud motor will be in the forward facing (correct) orientation. The motor will also lie forward of the rear axle which is also, I believe, the right design decision for the trike as far a weigh distribution is concerned.
All this does mean that the entire chassis (not just the front end) will have to be designed and built. This has real benefits but also makes the design a little more complex.
I have preliminary drawings which I hope to link to from my blog. I will be inviting advice, comments and discussion on the design once the images are linked.
A step in the wrong direction...
My first 'port-of-call' was: http://www.alfaowner.com
I introduced myself as a noob then set about my search for a 'sud motor.
I have to say, a more knowledgeable and friendlier bunch of people as you would ever hope to meet.
I explained that I wanted the engine for an impending trike project and, almost immediately, my request was greeted with input - all positive - from the forum users.
As generally happens on forums like these, people pitch in with opinions, thoughts and ideas. I got lucky. Although a motor had yet to materialize, one of the guys on the forum seemed to be taking quite alot of interest in my project. Several related discussions later, I realized I was discussing my project with someone who's engineering skills and experience were leaps and bounds ahead of mine and also, that I had made my first serious design error.
Some would argue that the VW beetle is an ideal donor vehicle for trikes. In some respects I would agree. It's air-cooled, so no hoses, radiators and ancillary stuff to deal with and the motor is tucked away at the back making the low-rider style easily achievable.
From the outset I had the idea of a low-rider in my head. For this reason, the idea of converting a bike to a trike was a no-go. It had to be built from the ground-up using a car as the donor of the parts.
But what about all that weight overhanging the rear axle? The VW trike is notoriously light at the front end. To such a degree that builders deliberately add huge amounts of weight to the front of the chassis in an effort to keep the front end on the tarmac. Did I think this was a good idea? No! To compound the problem, I had intended to swap the VW motor out for an Alfasud motor adding MORE weight (additional water-cooled weight) behind the rear axle.
Thankfully, my discussions with Lauren led me to accept what I really knew all along (but was too stubborn to admit). That I was about to embark on a project that incorporated inherently bad design ideas. I had actually designed something I wasn't happy with.
For the first time, not only was I asking myself but I was also BEING ASKED, whether this was what I really, really wanted?
This was a really imortant point. You really wouldn't want to invest all the time and effort and indeed all the money into (perhaps) a one-off project like this to say at the end of it all "I wish I'd done it another way!"
I introduced myself as a noob then set about my search for a 'sud motor.
I have to say, a more knowledgeable and friendlier bunch of people as you would ever hope to meet.
I explained that I wanted the engine for an impending trike project and, almost immediately, my request was greeted with input - all positive - from the forum users.
As generally happens on forums like these, people pitch in with opinions, thoughts and ideas. I got lucky. Although a motor had yet to materialize, one of the guys on the forum seemed to be taking quite alot of interest in my project. Several related discussions later, I realized I was discussing my project with someone who's engineering skills and experience were leaps and bounds ahead of mine and also, that I had made my first serious design error.
Some would argue that the VW beetle is an ideal donor vehicle for trikes. In some respects I would agree. It's air-cooled, so no hoses, radiators and ancillary stuff to deal with and the motor is tucked away at the back making the low-rider style easily achievable.
From the outset I had the idea of a low-rider in my head. For this reason, the idea of converting a bike to a trike was a no-go. It had to be built from the ground-up using a car as the donor of the parts.
But what about all that weight overhanging the rear axle? The VW trike is notoriously light at the front end. To such a degree that builders deliberately add huge amounts of weight to the front of the chassis in an effort to keep the front end on the tarmac. Did I think this was a good idea? No! To compound the problem, I had intended to swap the VW motor out for an Alfasud motor adding MORE weight (additional water-cooled weight) behind the rear axle.
Thankfully, my discussions with Lauren led me to accept what I really knew all along (but was too stubborn to admit). That I was about to embark on a project that incorporated inherently bad design ideas. I had actually designed something I wasn't happy with.
For the first time, not only was I asking myself but I was also BEING ASKED, whether this was what I really, really wanted?
This was a really imortant point. You really wouldn't want to invest all the time and effort and indeed all the money into (perhaps) a one-off project like this to say at the end of it all "I wish I'd done it another way!"
My first major design decision (continued)...
There are many, many valid reasons why someone would want to build a trike based on the VW beetle. Rewaco, Boom, Phoenix all produce sweet looking low-rider style trikes based on this configuration.
On the back of this you can buy lots of custom made parts for VW based trikes. When opting for this design, you start with the rear axle and suspension from the donor car. This is a bonus if you don't want to, or don't have the ability to design your own rear suspension. You simply buy or build the front end of the chassis and bolt the two halves together... job done!
There are drawbacks too. The basic design of the VW floorpan hasn't changed much over the last half century. Apart from the introduction of IRS (independent rear suspension) which the 1302S has, it's torsion bar system is as old as the hills.
Having taken receipt of the greasy, rusty heap of parts and steel that would form the basis of my trike, I set about some fairly intense computer aided chassis design in an effort to bring my dream machine to life.
Things were going well. I had a series of drawings - all to scale - that would provide an elegant solution for joining front and rear ends together. I was happy but something was bugging me really bad!
I never really liked the beetle engine for various reasons. I'd been constantly looking for a suitable beetle motor but never bought one. In hindsight, I'm pleased I didn't.
What if, I coupled the far-superior (IMO) Alfasud motor to the back of the VW box? There are adapter plates still available that facilitate this very combination. This way, I would have the motor that I (really) wanted. The search was on...
On the back of this you can buy lots of custom made parts for VW based trikes. When opting for this design, you start with the rear axle and suspension from the donor car. This is a bonus if you don't want to, or don't have the ability to design your own rear suspension. You simply buy or build the front end of the chassis and bolt the two halves together... job done!
There are drawbacks too. The basic design of the VW floorpan hasn't changed much over the last half century. Apart from the introduction of IRS (independent rear suspension) which the 1302S has, it's torsion bar system is as old as the hills.
Having taken receipt of the greasy, rusty heap of parts and steel that would form the basis of my trike, I set about some fairly intense computer aided chassis design in an effort to bring my dream machine to life.
Things were going well. I had a series of drawings - all to scale - that would provide an elegant solution for joining front and rear ends together. I was happy but something was bugging me really bad!
I never really liked the beetle engine for various reasons. I'd been constantly looking for a suitable beetle motor but never bought one. In hindsight, I'm pleased I didn't.
What if, I coupled the far-superior (IMO) Alfasud motor to the back of the VW box? There are adapter plates still available that facilitate this very combination. This way, I would have the motor that I (really) wanted. The search was on...
My first major design decision...
I did a whole lot of research before my first trip to the breakers yard. It would be an injustice not to mention the author of the document that stirred my creative juices and steered me toward the Alfasud as a donor vehicle: http://www.btinternet.com/~jhpart/bktrikep.htm
I've done a whole lot more research since which has led to a dead-end or two (and back). The research stage of the project is not over. I have yet to cut a single piece of tubing for the chassis. I'm not going to either, not until I have reached a design that I'm totally happy with. More blogging on this later.
I remember with delight as an apprentice spannerboy during the mid seventies, the magnificent sound the 'sud produced on the overrun from the exhaust. That splendid induction roar from the twin Webers or Del Ortos once the air box was removed. It was and still is, music to my ears.
As the author of the above document suggests the Alfasud boxer motor is an ideal candidate for three wheels. It's flat four configuration has a naturally low COG. Apart from anything else, it was a very, very powerful motor for its day, producing a not too shameful 105 BHP in stock trim. That's more than twice the horsepower of a stock beetle engine. And, it's an Alfa Romeo! I could go on.
However, there was not an Alfasud to be found anywhere locally. I got chatting with a guy at the yard. He was uber-helpful and he also had stuff to sell me. Apart from a very rare two wheel drive Subaru boxer he also hav VW stuff for sale. Everything I needed in fact, to start a trike build in VW mode as opposed to Alfasud mode (my original intention).
The Subaru was a tad expensive so we talked about trikes based on the fairly common VW-based design. John opened up my mind to other possibilities and managed to sway me into parting with some hard-earned for a VW 1302S floorpan, axle and gearbox. I wasn't too unhappy with my purchase at the time.
I've done a whole lot more research since which has led to a dead-end or two (and back). The research stage of the project is not over. I have yet to cut a single piece of tubing for the chassis. I'm not going to either, not until I have reached a design that I'm totally happy with. More blogging on this later.
I remember with delight as an apprentice spannerboy during the mid seventies, the magnificent sound the 'sud produced on the overrun from the exhaust. That splendid induction roar from the twin Webers or Del Ortos once the air box was removed. It was and still is, music to my ears.
As the author of the above document suggests the Alfasud boxer motor is an ideal candidate for three wheels. It's flat four configuration has a naturally low COG. Apart from anything else, it was a very, very powerful motor for its day, producing a not too shameful 105 BHP in stock trim. That's more than twice the horsepower of a stock beetle engine. And, it's an Alfa Romeo! I could go on.
However, there was not an Alfasud to be found anywhere locally. I got chatting with a guy at the yard. He was uber-helpful and he also had stuff to sell me. Apart from a very rare two wheel drive Subaru boxer he also hav VW stuff for sale. Everything I needed in fact, to start a trike build in VW mode as opposed to Alfasud mode (my original intention).
The Subaru was a tad expensive so we talked about trikes based on the fairly common VW-based design. John opened up my mind to other possibilities and managed to sway me into parting with some hard-earned for a VW 1302S floorpan, axle and gearbox. I wasn't too unhappy with my purchase at the time.
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